| Posted: 06 Jul 2010 16:52 |
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Greetings Fans!
Due to security blah blah blah I can't disclose too many details, however...
My name is "Angel of Eyr", and I am currently working on a school paper discussing Captain America and his parallels to American culture in a historic viewpoint.
Ex. In the early years during WWII, Cap was a soldier, no more. Then as America progressed he evolved into a symbol, serving as an idea rather than a soldier as WWII faded, then during the Cold War russian villains start to emerge, yada yada yada...
Any help at all would be greatly appreciated, specific comic issues that relate to a "big idea", books dedicated to this question,unknown people behind this that I may not know of.
I have already talked with Chuck Dixon and he has granted me his blessings and promised to let me meet with Ed Brubaker (the current writer of Captain America in case you didn't know. So I believe I am in good form.
The paper will be 3500 - 4000 words (fun right?)
If you nerds would like to help a fellow nerd out and give any sort of feedback/suggestions/ ideas it would be greatly appreciated. Also, if any of you have credentials (aka higher level degrees in history analysis or first hand experience in the production of Captain America) I would love to talk with you on the topic, and with permission, use you as a "source" (I require 40+ GREAT sources)
__________________~Forever Vigilant,Prepared to Vanquish those who prey on the Defenseless, to Protect and Safeguard the needy... awaiting orders~
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| Posted: 06 Jul 2010 17:19 Last Edited By: pingclang |
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Weeellll, im a big fan of Cap and even more so due to what he represents. Like you said, in WWII he was a soldier, which back in those days thats what the greatest heroes were. Men like Patton, MacArthur and all the way down to the freshly trained privates. In the sixties, what with Nam starting and Americans hating the war, soldiers were`nt really considered heroes, sad but true. Thus in the long run Cap had to be a symbol of better times and better heroes. As for landmark issues, I think #173-175 of he first volume showed some big time changes headed his way. Also the fact that in #117 he takes on a black partner in the face of racism and showing how that the races could live together and work as one. Theres so much stuff but these are the ones that stick out to me. As for the new times, hes been replaced by his once side-kick Bucky, the one from the 40s. Bucky uses a gun, stealth attacks and general spec ops type fighting. Hes a great addition to the tale, not as good as the original, but he shows how we have to addapt to the times. No more running in and whipping tail, we`ve gotta stratagize now. I could keep going but I wont. Hope this is helpful.
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| Posted: 06 Jul 2010 17:41 |
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If you're going to study Captain America, you going to have to study Hero worshipping and the importance of mythology and storytelling in society.
Thor smites enemies and monsters with lightning bolts produced by his hammer. Zeus sends messages through lightning bolts. This was a way to tell children of things unknown and frightening to help them develop and grow up physically and mentally stable. It may work and may not work, but it has grown to be great entertainment.
As a child growing up in a big city, with news of riots, crime, racism and bad western shows on tv, comics with heroes battling crime and giving me great stories of Sci-fi, fantasy and comedy, ... it was a welcome escape from that.
People look at those 70s Cap comics, Englehart and Buscema books, and see often-told stories, camp, out dated materials, etc., but to me, they were that time, with racism, crime and crumbling infrastructure. Someway, Cap was fighting that, surviving living in big cities and the problems of society and the country.
Gruenwald saw that during his over 10 years run, having Cap deal with the Serpent Society (Organized crime), drugs, etc.
That's my view and feelings.
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| Posted: 06 Jul 2010 19:41 |
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Thank you very much, and thank you specifically for the issues.. and please Pingclang, continue all that you want, I'm all ears
__________________~Forever Vigilant,Prepared to Vanquish those who prey on the Defenseless, to Protect and Safeguard the needy... awaiting orders~
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| Posted: 06 Jul 2010 19:45 |
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One of my main obstacles in being a "youngin'". My only scope is of recent Cap, so please, any personal stories about how Cap related to you growing up through the years would be great.
__________________~Forever Vigilant,Prepared to Vanquish those who prey on the Defenseless, to Protect and Safeguard the needy... awaiting orders~
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| Posted: 07 Jul 2010 06:18 |
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One of my personal favorite Cap stories is the 2002 run by Rieber and Cassaday. It was right on the heel of 9/11.
It was a very good story and how Cap had to adjust to this new post 9/11 world.
Storyline is called THE NEW DEAL.
http://www.amazon.com/Captain-America-1-New-Deal/dp/0785111018/re ...
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| Posted: 07 Jul 2010 14:06 |
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I know some guys may not think its all that important,but in 1997 they restarted Cap and went back to issue #1 and in that first issue Cap is in Japan where, due to events at the time, he suddenly appeared after supposedly dieing. While there he sees Japan celebrating Captain America with a movie and selling all sorts of Cap memorabilia. I like this issue becuase he talks about how he doesn`t represent the dollar bill and making money off his image but that his image is a manifestation of all that is good and wholesome in America. Also it talks a lot in this issue of preserving the history and culture of ones country. Its a great read and shows the political side of Cap. Rod pointed out a great series in the form of the new deal line, its a great example of Cap`s mindset. He helps just as much as Steve Rogers as he does as Cap. Once again, hope all this helps.
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| Posted: 07 Jul 2010 15:36 |
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When i was a small kid, I obviously was not hip or educated on politics or anything like that but Captain America fascinated me. I loved his backstory and he really gave me a sense of pride in my country and my flag. I remember saying the pledge of allegience in school and i always felt like i did that for Cap! I always pictured him under that flag holding up his sheild when i recited that. He was always just a sense of positivity to me. He made me wanna learn about my country.
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| Posted: 07 Jul 2010 19:17 |
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Captain America to me represents the best qualities of ourselves as well as pride in our country and appreciation for other countries. He is the one you can count on to do the right thing and make hard decisions that are in the best interests of others and not himself. To me, he represents courage, sacrifice, pride, bravery, integrity, and leadership. I grew up in a military family, so that was another connection for me growing up. Cap is an ordinary man who does extraordinary things and that has always served as an inspiration to me to try and be the best i could be as i continue to grow. That's why he's tatted on my forearm.
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| Posted: 08 Jul 2010 12:39 |
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Well said James! that is why I have him on my forearm too.
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| Posted: 08 Jul 2010 19:11 |
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Quote:
Well said James! that is why I have him on my forearm too.
Exactly!
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| Posted: 14 Jul 2010 01:40 |
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Looking for: Atomic99
I would really liek to talk to him and ask permission to use some of his content as well as possibly his podcast I have heard about.
So, if you see this please post and viewers, if you know how to reach him, ask him to come by this way.
Also, if anybody has tips to exchange personal information over this medium or advice on "how to" do this safely, I am open to ideas.
Atomic99: I was very interested in your post regarding Captain America Essentials and Milestones as well as this podcast I heard that you worked on. Any tips on sources, best 20 year time frame (year to year) that would yeild the best results, or your own personal thought would be amazing. If you decide to contact me I will give much more information and details regarding this project. This is for a grade and... my high school diploma kinda depends on it. Thank you very much.
(P.S. I just realized.. Captain America.. putting one of America's youth through school.. wow.. who knew.)
__________________~Forever Vigilant,Prepared to Vanquish those who prey on the Defenseless, to Protect and Safeguard the needy... awaiting orders~
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| Posted: 14 Jul 2010 05:51 |
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It was around the 80s that I stopped analyzing my fascination with Captain America. Of course I blogged that Cap as an avator for handling the unrest and insecurities of growing up theory, acceptable, reasonable, and I did go through that, but there's that father/hero worship that kids have, fascinated with shapes and colors, looking for a better brother, hang around me for a month and you'll probably come up with dozens of interpretations and theories on why I like Captain America. My friends and family have given up trying to understand or explain it.
I hope you get some definite answers from others, but my advice, just enjoy and go along.
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| Posted: 14 Jul 2010 06:31 |
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I'm here! You can post here or reach me at atomic99@comcast.net.
Technically, it isn't my podcast but Jamie D of the Comic Geek Speak group. I was just his guest for the one show. But since he and I are big Cap fans, the Essential Cap show ended up covering it all for over 3 hours. You can find that show here:
http://www.comicgeekspeak.com/episodes/essentials-839.php
Comic Geek Speak's Spotlight on Cap in the Golden Age has editor Steve Saffel. That can be found here:
http://www.comicgeekspeak.com/episodes/comic_geek_speak-1086.php
CGS' Spotlight on Cap in the Marvel Age (60s and 70s) has Roy Thomas and long time fan Lenny. You can find that here:
http://www.comicgeekspeak.com/episodes/comic_geek_speak-1115.php
They actually Spotlighted Cap 4.5 years ago too in an earlier show here:
http://www.comicgeekspeak.com/episodes/comic_geek_speak-116.php
You are welcome to quote from anything we said. I imagine you have to cite your references and quotes for a paper that size though.
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| Posted: 14 Jul 2010 06:39 |
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I wrote this last week but didn't post it until I could proofread it. It is lengthy, gets into politics, which can sometimes get people flustered, but it is my own viewpoints only. I basically wrote most of your paper here! lol But don't plagiarize it! That will get you flunked! Use it with other information you acquire and write your own.
This book will help you. It can be a dry read but it is a series of essays written in an academic format that covers Captain America and real life history...
http://www.amazon.com/Captain-America-Struggle-Superhero-Critical ...
The following is a little long. Read it in chunks if you like. It also reflects my own personal opinions on how I see things. Others with other politic persuasions and ideologies might view things differently......
Pre-Brubaker era, I use to get some puzzled looks from some comic fans about Captain America. For some fans of Cap, they've adopted the character to represent the pinnacle of their ideals of what America should be from their own perspective. For some fans, they also appreciate the more action style of the character. And then, for some of those that it didn't appeal to, they assumed the book and character was just a bunch of flag waving and jingoism.
For me, one of the things that appeals to me, is the Captain America character very much mirrors our own society at that time.
THE 1940s
During Cap's first year, the pre-Pearl Harbor bombing era of Simon and Kirby's first 10 issues, the Axis were the villains as Jack Kirby and Joe Simon could see the coming storm, already happening in Europe, but coming to America's shores. But behind the scenes, the creators were getting death threats for having their character attack Hitler on the first cover, a sign that some of the American public at that time were separatists, isolationists, & Nazi sympathizers. One early story even involved a Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, or rather a fictional Hawaiian island that was the Pacific Fleet's home port. This was printed many months BEFORE December 7th, 1941. So, in a way, in those first few issues, Captain America Comics were not so much representing American Culture at the time but PREDICTING it a year earlier as some didn't even know where Pearl Harbor was before the fleet was attacked.
During the war years, Cap was the ultimate American hero, paralleling the nation now united against the Axis powers. And the book thrived during this era as Cap started to appear in other titles. He wasn't the first patriotic hero but he was the most successful of this time. What sometimes happens during wartime is a demonizing of the enemy to help rally public opinion and simplify things into black and white. And Cap was no exception as the Germans and Japanese were portrayed as caricatures and monstrosities. Some of it might be considered racist now but such was the times.
Cap's post war era also reflected the times as he struggled to find his place. The book lasted almost five years after the war but tried to shake things up with Steve Rogers becoming a school teacher or having a female sidekick in an effort to increase falling sales. His appearances in other books began to dwindle too. As the nation standed down from War, so did Cap.
America had grown up after the war, as did the comic book readers, many whom were G.I.s, and that influence was felt with many child sidekicks being dropped for the Timely heroes of the Human Torch, Sub-Mariner (no sidekick, really), and Captain America as all three gained their own female sidekicks to appeal to an older boy audience now interested in girls. Just as movies during the post-war were taking on darker themes during this Noir era, some comics were as well into the 1950s much to the chagrin of Dr. Wertham. EC Comics were successful for a time with their graphic horror. The Captain America book soon took on a horror theme, even changing its title name towards the end, but, in truth, the Cap comics always had a horror theme. Early stories during the Simon & Kirby run had these horror elements but were usually inspired by the horror cinema of the 1930s. But post war, the country had seen much more real life horror at Aushwitz and Dachau.
THE 1950s
A brief revival in the 1950s tried to re-invigorate the character as the Nazis were swapped out for the Communists, America's new threat during the Cold War. Even the Red Skull became a card-carrying commie pinko! But just as the McCarthyism bubble popped, so did this short revival. Meanwhile, original Cap creators Simon & Kirby were launching a Cap knock off called Fighting American who also battles the Communists. But as the creators and America began to see the folly of McCarthyism, the Fighting American also started to become a parody of it's self.
THE 1960s
The 1960s saw the Captain America character revived yet again as he struggled to find his place in the new "modern" world. Writers during this time had a hard time pinning down the character since what worked 20 years earlier wasn't going to work in the 1960s. The world, and the Viet-Nam War, were not as black and white as World War II and some began to wonder if America was flawed in going to war in South East Asia. For the most part, Cap didn't reflected that ambivalence as the stories mostly stayed away from Cap in Viet-Nam except for one or two stories. But just as America was showing its flaws, so did the new generation of Marvel Heroes. Not the perfect heroes of the 1940s like Superman and Batman, the Marvel Heroes featured the flawed protagonist with real life problems. Spider-man felt guilt over his Uncle's death. Ben Grimm agonized over his appearance. And even Cap felt the pain of the loss of his sidekick, Bucky. These new heroes had human failings.
There were still some terrific tales during the 1960s. Some involved retro tales of Cap's WWII adventures, another allegory to some of the nation still seeing the Viet-Nam War as something like WWII. There were also adventures of Cap with Agent 13 Sharon Carter, Nick Fury, and S.H.I.E.L.D. as the comic embraced the Secret agent craze of the 1960s. The new hero and new soldier for the Cold War was the secret agent using espionage in the spy world. Like the gadgets of the agents, they toyed ever so briefly with some gadgets for Cap like magnets under his glove to help return his shield or the electronics disguise under his "A" on his mask in one story. Villain organizations like Hydra and A.I.M. were featured much like S.P.E.C.T.R.E. in the Bond movies or C.H.A.O.S. in the GET SMART television series.
THE 1970s
Sales continued to drop as writers tried to find the right tone to the book. The younger generation who were the new comic readers were interested in civil rights and protesting the war. The Cap book reflected those changes when Cap took on a partner, the Falcon, whom I believe was the first African-American hero in mainstream comics. The Falcon even shared the title with Cap for most of the 1970s. Story lines featured war protesters on college campuses, Cap and Falcon fighting crime in black neighborhoods, and even Cap doing an Easy Rider thing as he questioned his place in America.
One story that really did well was the Secret Empire epic that ended with a high ranking government official running a secret organization. It was implied to be President Nixon and that character's corruption and suicide results in Cap's faith in America being shaken, just as many Americans were having with their country, government, and President at the time. Cap eventually comes to the conclusion that he doesn't represent the government but the IDEALS that American stands for.
THE 1980s
For the most part, the 1980s were a comfortable era for Cap as he settled in for some pleasant stories during the Byrne/Stern run, the Zeck/DeMattais era of the early 80s and the first half of Mark Gruenwald's long ten year run. One story from 1980 features an effort to have Cap run for president, which he eventually declines. The American people were searching for someone to trust and who better than Captain America just as, in real life, the nation was still feeling the distrust of the Nixon era and became disenchanted with the malaise of the Carter Administration. People wanted a win for America after the Iran Hostage situation and perhaps a Captain America would do they trick as we got a classic and noble hero in the Byrne/Stern run. In real life, the nation got President Reagan who did instill an America that was feeling good about it's self again. There was still desent in the nation and world as people protested nukes and the escalation of the arms race but the comics rarely reflected that. Even the Cold War had been de-thawing for a number of years with Nixon visiting China in the early 1970s so you rarely had any Russian villains in the Cap books but did have some Russian heroes like Black Widow and members of the Champions in the 1970s in the Marvel books. Sure, Mark Gruenwald did portray President Reagan as a snake but, for the most part, the populace was happy with the direction of the Nation.
The Reagan era was marred by the Iran-Contra scandal known as Contra-Gate with the USA covertly selling arms to Iran and to fund the Contras and, perhaps, the parallel in the 80s was when Cap stepped down after government intervention and a new more morally ambivalent Cap in the former of John Walker took over the role. But, to compare the two events would probably be a stretch.
THE 1990s
By the late 1980s and into the early 1990s, Cap took on themes that America was dealing with like the Drug War in the "Streets of Poison" story and steroids. By 1995, Cap got a breath of fresh air when Mark Waid and Ron Garney took over after Mark Gruenwald's long run, which, at this point, had grown a little long in the tooth. America was also going through a revival after a lengthy period of conservative leadership with Reagan and Bush as a younger President Clinton took over. Conservatives now had their new adversary but the nation's economy was humming along in this post-Cold War era. On the flip side, Conservatives could claim victories in 1994 with Newt Gingrich and the Neo Con movement coming into its own as paralleling the new era of Cap. But, real national news events like Monica Lewinsky and the war in Kosovo were never reflected in the Cap book as the character had long ago divorced himself from the government and most politics and just represented the best of American Ideals.
THE 2000s
That all changed after September 11th, 2001, however. How could a patriotic character NOT react to the events of that day? And so the title relaunched again under the more serious Marvel Knights banner to have the character take on the more real life problems of the nation like terrorism. In the first issue, as a sober Steve Rogers walks among the ruins of the World Trade center, a person asks Steve where he was when the towers fell. "I wasn't here," says Rogers, reflecting our own nation caught off guard.
Much like the time, things started out promising with a nation galvanized but, like the book itself, things began to lose focus and steam. It seemed comic readers probably preferred their terrorists to wear colorful costumes rather than the clothes of radical extremists in real life and the focus on finding Osama bin Laden in the mountains in Afghanistan turned into a focus to get Saddam Hussein in Iraq. Stories did look at the topics of the day and questioned just how clean our nation's hands were in our fight for good as themes like Guantánamo Bay and the "Ice" story line were presented.
Eventually things were relaunched again (the theme of Rebirth in Cap's origin, his stories, and his comic runs comes up frequently) as Ed Brubaker introduced us to a Cap in 2005 who was still strong in purpose but had to deal with the past re-emerging its self with Bucky returning, old villains in the Red Skull, Arnim Zola, and Dr. Faustus, and old story lines returning like the 1950s Cap and Sleepers. Such was America as the ghosts of the first Persian Gulf War had re-emerged in the form of Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden. The artwork was darker, more realistic, with a return to that covert spy feel of the 1960s but updated and perhaps this is the face of the new America as it fights two wars on Terror with high tech innovations and covert intel.
The best example of how Cap parallel's American Culture in the 2000s, however, can be found in The Ultimates and the Civil War mini series. In The Ultimates, we have a Captain America much different than the one we are are use to. He's jingoistic, doesn't stop to give speeches unless it is a dig on France, and acts first and thinks about the consequences later. In many ways, America does the same, not thinking about the long term effects of a prolonged war in Iraq or reacting to France's opposition to America invading Iraq in 2003 with Freedom Fries and boycotting other such French items (regardless of it being French in origin or not) and digs against France as a nation for "giving up" during WWII even though France was instrumental in helping America win its independence from England during the Revolutionary War, had an active resistance to Hitler during their occupation, and one of our greatest American symbols, the Statue of Liberty, being a gift from a French man. Although, to be fair, the Ultimates dig was written by a Brit and they've been exchanging insults with the French for centuries.
CVIL WAR essentially mimicked the debate in the country at the time of Civil Rights over the Security of the Nation as we considered how much of our own personal liberties in wire tapping and airport screening do we want to allow to protect ourselves. While the series ended with Captain America giving up (apparently this one MUST be French!!!! lol), the story really ended in CAPTAIN AMERICA #25 as Cap is shot and "killed" by Sharon Carter, Crossbones, and the Red Skull’s plan. The news media picked up on the story that March of 2007 and pundits debated the hidden meaning in Cap’s death as commentary on the Death of America under the Bush Administration to those saying you shouldn’t kill a (fictional) character during a time of war. Long time comic readers, though, knew that characters rarely stay dead.
THE 2010s
A few short years later, more controversy ensued as CAPTAIN AMERICA #602 featured Bucky Captain America and the Falcon going to Idaho to infiltrate a Watchdogs organization. Signs in a group of protestors drew the ire of conservative bloggers and media as they felt it portrayed the Tea Party Movement in a negative light despite the sign slogans being taken from real signs. Rather than representing American culture of today, the controversy just highlighted the divisions in American between Red State and Blue State politics and ideologies in today's Culture War.
The new Bucky Cap is still being defined but, as the character finds his way from out of his past and he struggles to live up to the legacy of Steve Rogers. Perhaps the nation is now doing the same as we struggle to live up to our past accomplishments in a challenging time economically and globally.
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| Posted: 15 Jul 2010 01:06 |
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You have no idea how much this helps me guide my paper. I am against plagerizing and rest easy that all work will be original (no striaght copy and pasting), but it will be severly considered. Your links are amazing and I can send you the finished copy if you want to read it for whatever reason, will probobly be everything you already know anyhow. Anyways, I thank you so much again. You rock 
__________________~Forever Vigilant,Prepared to Vanquish those who prey on the Defenseless, to Protect and Safeguard the needy... awaiting orders~
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| Posted: 15 Jul 2010 02:23 |
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Just post the paper here for all to see.
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